Ramblings of an old Doc

Sam Biddle at Gizmodo reports (and confirmed by the Arizona Police) that lulzSec has hacked Arizona Law Enforcement because of Arizona's "racial profiling anti-immigrant police state that is Arizona".

The newest data reveal "hundreds of private intelligence bulletins, training manuals, personal email correspondence, names, phone numbers, addresses and passwords belonging to Arizona law enforcement."

“The release, entitled "Chinga La Migra" (F**k the Border Patrol) is the first time LulzSec's purported to release personal information of government agents, rather than just disrupting their websites (see: CIA, US Senate). This is a powerful move. Home addresses are home addresses—about as personal as personal data gets. LulzSec's also clearly placed a political motive behind this thrust, as opposed to the HACK HACK LMAO ethos we've seen before.” – Gizmodo

lulzSec states:

“Every week we plan on releasing more classified documents and embarassing {can’t even spell!}  personal details of military and law enforcement in an effort not just to reveal
their racist and corrupt nature but to purposefully sabotage their efforts to terrorize communities fighting an unjust "war on drugs".”

 

I don’t like illegal border crossings. I also don’t like the fact that police who have to interact with various communities in (hopefully) constructive and non-confrontational ways having the impossible onus of illegal alien hunting put on them. The Police don’t like it either. It’s dangerous, and it’s antithetical to integrating LEGAL immigrants and their families into the community.

What I dislike the most is the tactic of releasing classified training and tactical information. This endangers the people who stand between us and criminals of all stripe.  That is unjustified.

Worse: Revealing their home addresses puts their families in danger from every sort of criminal, socio- and psychopath.

No amount of rationalization justifies this. Period.

Ultimately, what lulzSec did here is illegal and immoral.

Should any harm come to the people who defend us and/or their families and property, I hope they are identified, captured and punished to the fullest extent of the law.


Comments (Page 7)
11 PagesFirst 5 6 7 8 9  Last
on Jun 26, 2011

I am not responsible for lulzSec or any such bunch of obnoxious children.....[I chose NOT to breed]...but if you wish me to be...I shall take responsibility....just give me the gun and point me at them.

And this is precisely the reason we have laws.

on Jun 26, 2011

sareth01
And this is precisely the reason we have laws.

Oh...you mean the laws these brats choose not to abide by?

on Jun 26, 2011

Why oh why do people and institutions store such information in a network.  For that matter, why is it every time a security bill is being drafted up something wild happens to justify it?

on Jun 26, 2011

Why is it that umbrellas seem to open just after the rain happens to justify it?

 

on Jun 26, 2011

I suppose we're closer to agreement than not, Monk, but I don't agree that 'society' is culpable or that any sort of top-down societal 'fix' is either possible or desirable, the latter because it let's us off the hook too easily.

 

We are all culpable in everything that happens in this world since we as the individual are part of the whole.  Again, I wasn't advocating a "top-down fix" rather a fix which starts with each individual (who is part of the whole) and is then realised to its full potential by the whole.

on Jun 26, 2011

the_Monk
We are all culpable in everything that happens in this world

With that I fundamentally disagree.  It's entirely counter to the notions of free will and individual autonomy, which define freedom of, and responsibility for, action.

An argument can be made that we share culpability for inaction in certain circumstances, but not for the actions of individuals.

on Jun 26, 2011

DrJBHL
Why is it that umbrellas seem to open just after the rain happens to justify it?

 

 

I think a more accurate depiction of Rogue Captain's post would be "why is it that umbrellas seem to open just before the rain happens to justify it?" 

on Jun 26, 2011

the_Monk
We are all culpable in everything that happens in this world since we as the individual are part of the whole.

No...we are all culpable for what we do [or fail to do] as individuals.

These 'individuals' as pertaining to the OP are culpable for what they do.  They are no different, no matter how much 'fun' they wish to have at others' expense.

The frustrating thing is that too many people laud their actions as something clever and/or heroic.

Brats deserve to be slapped.

 

"Forgive them for they know not what they do" is a quaint ideal, nothing more.

on Jun 26, 2011


With that I fundamentally disagree.  It's entirely counter to the notions of free will and individual autonomy, which define freedom of, and responsibility for, action.

An argument can be made that we share culpability for inaction in certain circumstances, but not for the actions of individuals.

 

When those actions are being perpetuated by our offspring/children then yes we do share in the culpability of it all.  Even if it is only indirectly and only a minute amount, we do have shared culpability and as such (if we were responsible) we would do anything/everything in our power to effect change always keeping that responsibility in mind.  Of course such may be deemed an altruistic standpoint by some, but if enough people chose to do something about it instead of succumbing to the prevailing attitude of today (apathy) we might actually see real change happening.

 

EDIT:  "Free will" and all/any notions associated with that are another topic entirely.  We have all chosen (with our free will) to be part of a society.  As such we are all responsible for its success or failure.  Unless of course some of you want to afford the extraneous in our society the luxury (free will) of claiming ignorance and allow their lack of responsiblity and sense of entitlement to preclude them from consequences.  Either we are all responsible for what/where we as a society are (at present) or none of us are.  You cannot have it both ways.

on Jun 26, 2011

the_Monk
When those actions are being perpetuated by our offspring/children then yes we do share in the culpability of it all. Even if it is only indirectly and only a minute amount, we do have shared culpability and as such (if we were responsible) we would do anything/everything in our power to effect change always keeping that responsibility in mind. Of course such may be deemed an altruistic standpoint by some, but if enough people chose to do something about it instead of succumbing to the prevailing attitude of today (apathy) we might actually see real change happening.

We have a fundamental philosophical disagreement here.  You can choose to accept a degree of culpability for the actions of your children if you wish, but that's voluntary - you cannot ask or expect others ('society') to accept any such culpability for the actions of your children.  What would you propose I do about the actions of your children?  How is declining to accept culpability for the actions of others equivalent to apathy?  I have no idea what 'effect change' means in this context.

the_Monk
EDIT: "Free will" and all/any notions associated with that are another topic entirely. We have all chosen (with our free will) to be part of a society. As such we are all responsible for its success or failure. Unless of course some of you want to afford the extraneous in our society the luxury (free will) of claiming ignorance and allow their lack of responsiblity and sense of entitlement to preclude them from consequences. Either we are all responsible for what/where we as a society are (at present) or none of us are. You cannot have it both ways.

You are conflating free will and responsibility, which are two different things.  And your last two sentences proffer a false dichotomy - the reality is that we are each individually responsible for our own behavior and actions and the 'society' is the result of where the chips fall.  That's the only way to influence the greater 'society' - it's the net result of countless individual actions and interactions.  The fact that we as human beings are intelligent enough to come together and act in the interest of the common good does not mean, ipso facto, that all of us are responsible for everything. 

on Jun 26, 2011

Humanity has been torturing and executing criminals for thousands of years, most likely for ten's of thousand's of year, and quite possibly for more than 100,000 years. No matter how just, torture and execution as a means of crime prevention is a complete failure!

If parents, teachers, leaders, and governments engaged our world with more compassion and taught the hackers to have more love for all people, then perhaps the hackers would have placed a greater value on our right to privacy. Even if more love and compassion failed to stop the hackers, I would rather live in a world that has more love and less rage.

on Jun 26, 2011

chuckve4
taught the hackers to have more love for all people, then perhaps the hackers would have placed a greater value on our right to privacy

Don't hold your breath.....

on Jun 26, 2011

chuckve4
If parents, teachers, leaders, and governments engaged our world with more compassion

Well, it's certainly your privilege to be naive, to wish upon a star and to make unprovable assumptions.  Since we don't have the ability to conduct a double-blind controlled clinical trial on whether 'compassion' trumps an equitable justice system in producing a 'better world', we'll probably never know.  This sort of deflection of responsibility away from the perpetrators is just as likely to be responsible for such behavior as a lack of compassion.  Until there is evidence one way or the other (and it ain't comin'), we have to choose between them based on logic, the principal of individual autonomy and the history of human behavior.

I'm not sure which planet you wish to live on, chuckve4, but I don't consider expecting others to be held accountable for their actions to be 'rage' here on this one.  Who's to say those hackers weren't taught to have 'more love for all people'?  And I strongly suspect that any 'punishment' meted out will fall somewhat short of 'torture and execution'.  It is certainly possible that one or more of these perps will see the error of their ways and begin acting responsibly as a result of being forced to confront the real-world consequences of what they've done.  However, given the arrogance necessary to do what they did, their apparent conviction that they knew what was best for the rest of us, I'm not holding my breath.

When you find that world you'd rather live in, buy a ticket pronto.

on Jun 26, 2011

This thread = the large gentleman:

on Jun 26, 2011

chuckve4
If parents, teachers, leaders, and governments engaged our world with more compassion and taught the hackers to have more love for all people, then perhaps the hackers would have placed a greater value on our right to privacy. Even if more love and compassion failed to stop the hackers, I would rather live in a world that has more love and less rage.

Absolutely. No question. "The lion shall lie down with the lamb..... they shall beat their swords into plough shares and the voice of the turtle shall be heard throughout the land." (mix and match). Actually, it's not an either/or.

As long as there are laws, there will be criminals... So the solution is simple: Burn the law books, close the courts and find the lawyers other jobs. Let's institute universal love and start singing (Joan will give you the words):

 

*edit... while hunting up the vid, Daiwa made his post.

11 PagesFirst 5 6 7 8 9  Last