All well and good to say if you still have control of parenting. Here in Oz, effective parenting/discipline has been taken away from us by government... which has incessantly been lobbied by do-gooders who seem to think the rights of children take precedence over adult responsibilities.

I do not think it is reasonable that a parent can be charged for grounding a disobedient child, yet I was... deprivation of liberty.

I do not think it is reasonable that a parent can be threatened by police for withholding pocket money from a disobedient child, yet I was... threatened with 'charges' if it was not reinstated to restore "social equality"

I do not think it is reasonable that a parent can be charged with theft after confiscating their own mobile phone from a child because it was being used for nefarious purposes, yet I was... despite showing proof of purchase [a receipt in my name] I was held in a police holding cell for 8 hours until I agreed to return my own phone [loaned] to my step-daughter, all because [according to the cops] her SIM card was in it.

I do not think it is reasonable that a parent be threatened with charges of kidnapping and deprivation of liberty for deadlocking all the windows and doors to protect a child from herself and those with intentions to exploit her, yet I was... she used the mobile phone I had to hand back to call police.  Again I was carted off to lockup and held until I agreed to various police demands.

I do not think it is reasonable that the Police Minister, also Minister for Families can threaten a parent with "shut up and go away or else", yet I was.... for simply trying to protect a my step-daughter from herself and others by seeking that the relevant authorities did their jobs as prescribed by law.

Through these events I was forced to leave the state I had called home for almost 10 years. Now I could understand the police intervention and attitude if I had belted her black and blue or something, but that wasn't the case.  No, I was trying to do the right thing, as any responsible parent would, and all I got for my trouble was police and government harassment...  a child who [then] disobeyed me/us because police and government said she could.

All this do-gooder interference and government intervention has done little to wipe out real child abuse [it still exists behind closed doors], but it has given rise to another and all too often unpunished crime... parental abuse.  A woman exhibiting several nasty bruises recently disclosed to me that both her 14 and 15 year old sons beat her and her husband, yet the police do no more than give these unruly brats a slap on the wrist and send them home to do it again and again.

So no, it's not always down to "piss poor parenting", more that do-gooders and government have stuck their noses too far into family life and seriously curtailed the ability of parents to do their jobs.

Fortunately, that disobedient and unruly girl is now a good and responsible mother herself... something she attributes to our teachings, love and persistence.  What we then thought went in one ear and out the other was indeed a positive influence in her life, and for that I cannot be more glad or proud.  Despite my/our earlier fears, she has exceeded our hopes for her.

Looks like they won't be stopping any time soon: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-06-28-anonymous-anonymous-lulzsec 

Exact same thing here in the US starkers, children run amok and parental abuse is prevalent everywhere. Now when you tell your kid to do something, they tell you to get f'd.

Indeed. There will always be a "do gooder" who "knows" more than you, and better than you who simply can't be wrong about that and who'll impose his/her agenda on you.

The arrogance is incredible. You just don't know as well as they do and if you argue you're a fossil or worse.

So very glad about her, starkers. Shaunna's and your hard work paid off... and that just makes me so happy.

Wow startkers, that does sound f'ed uped. Were these rules taken well by Australians or was the population forced to swallow these laws? 

Also glad to hear about your daughter. 

One thing I have noticed in Canada is that children are also very unruly, disrespectful and lazy as all hell. I am definitely no expert but I am old enough to see the difference between the past were dad worked 40hrs per week and mom was home to where dad works 60hrs per week and mom also works leaving a lot of children raised by MTV and pizza pops. Sport fields are now ALWAYS empty and the park behind my house has the odd new mom with an infant. I have a soccer field, baseball field, tennis courts and lawn bowling behind my backyard and the elderly lawn bowlers far outnumber all the other field uses by far. To me that is a very bad sign of things to come.

When the state raises your children, the state is the only parent they will recognize. That's how Communist,  Nazi and every other totalitarian despotic reign that's been  got kids to turn in their own parents for "political crimes"....all for the good of the kids of course.

Funny how old things are new again--we've just changed "for the good of the state" to "for you".

the legal definition of citizen has also evolved over the years, check it out to confirm the police state theory. 

I visited in class at our local middle school a few years ago and watched the kids mock the teacher, swear, be openly disruptive, etc.  One was sent to the office (for swearing) and later another was reprimanded again for acting up and told to stop "or else".  Their response was, "Or else what?  You can't really do anything."...at which point the teacher just looked away and tried to go back to the lesson.

I was there that day because one of my sons had some trouble in that class and had told me it was "hard to learn" there.

One of my son's friends, missed 63 days of attendance in her senior year with no excuse and was allowed to  graduate anyway.  She had missed 48 days the previous year.

In our town we have a separate school where if you fail or just don't bother showing up in regular school you can go there, miss up to 2 days a week of classes and regardless of the grade on your work--as long as you turn it in--graduate with a full HS diploma in less than a quarter of a school year.

All this is done "for the kids"--and there are some very few kids with genuinely special circumstances that things like this might be needed for--but the message it sends is, "no standards", "no expectations", "no authority", and "do what you want--it's all good".

Part of my issue with the "evil government" hyperbole is it's already trite to be "patriotic" or to examine your nation's history without a heavier dose of criticism than praise and there is little else left to look to as a standard as it is.

When we as a society tolerate and even approve the worst forms of behavior and normalize and excuse it, it will effect even the best of kids.

So what's to respect?  All we teach kids now with "government backing" is, "Do whatever you want--that's what it's all about".

I think that's why guys like lulzsec  are all over.

Time for everyone to realise that there IS an argument FOR Corporal punishment and Capital punishment.

All that's left is to determine where one stops and the other starts.

lol!

Capital pun!

You mean we can use Titans on kids?  Gee...I'm not sure that's really appropriate...corvettes, maybe.

"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."  

~Ben Franklin

I'm fortunate... my kids have grown up and now have kids of their own, and now they avoid telling me to get f**ked because they don't want their kids overhearing and getting any ideas farther on down the track..  And the grandkids, well they're all a bit too young to be speaking that way as yet, and hopefully they never do.

Yeah, there was a time when I thought she would always be the black sheep of the family, but she proved me wrong and I've never been happier in my life to have been proved wrong.  Yes, I am so proud of her and of all the effort she makes to be a good mother to her children.  Yes, we had our differences and difficulties, but things could not be better between us now.  We've put all that behind us and I'm pleased.

No, Aussie parents took rather badly to these totalitarian laws regarding parenting and their kids, not that it does/did them any good.  The Department of Families in each state is a cess pool of wannabe child experts, and sadly they too often stick their noses in where they'd be better off not... and when they should be intervening they all too often wait until it is too late.  I have absolutely no time for any of them... and should one of them dare to knock on my door for any reason, I'll be using some quite explicit language to show them off the property. 

No child will ever be abused or treated badly on my watch, and I'll defend the right of anyone under my roof to be responsible parents... and if that means a smack to deter harmful behaviour, etc, then so be it.  My son and his partner are here with their kids right now, and even I don't interfere in their family matters, so I'm not about to let some jumped up university graduate with no kids or parenting skills butt in where they're not needed.

Sinperium, in post #143 you described just about every public school in Australia.  They are not places of learning anymore... well maybe for a sensible minority, but for the most part kids go there to hang out and socialise.  I have a 17 y/o niece who will be leaving school this year and entering university next.  She is one of just a handful who actually go there to learn and better herself, which to me is a sad indictment on society in general. 17 girls in her year alone have fallen pregnant during 2011... all up 39 girls at the school... and the year's not over yet.  Why aren't the parents doing anything about it?  That'd be government interference, dictating terms that give kids 'rights' over and above what they should be entitled to.

The corporal punishment should stop only when... nah, bugger it... just keep it going for mongrels who know no respect.

As for capital punishment.... should start in Federal Parliament and continue down through the state counterparts... 

Since it's politicians, should we call it "Capitol punishment"? 

Whatever your stance, it is a good video.