SD was used as an example of simple commercial practise.

The only people who ever complained about the inclusion of IE with the OS was Europe....because both Netscape and Opera came from Europe.

There is absolutely no legitimate reason NOT consider a web browser as part of an OS, just as Notepad is 'part of an OS'....in fact a browser is MORE legitimate....

When one uses emotive argument such as 'pull a fast one'....one has lost.

Is this a fictional land where painting children's toys with lead isn't a criminal activity because of known health hazards, and companies aren't required by law to post notice of such things as lead content?  If so, then yes, it's still okay to make those toys.  If they were really known to be dangerous, they would be outlawed.  A great many things are that shouldn't, such as diazinon, which was taken off store shelves and restricted to licensed agricultural applications because stupid people were spraying it in nurseries despite clear warnings that it was harmful to children and only for outdoor use..

In equating product availability with what are knowingly harmful criminal acts against children, you have made a truly stellar example of an irrational, out of context argument.  I will assume the language barrier is responsible for the rest, so few of us seem to actually speak english these days.

So what you're saying here vis that support for Win 7 has already ended, that it won't work on new hardware? 

What I read is that MS is saying that Win 7 won't run on PCs with Skylake or later CPUs, which sort of suggests some collaboration between it and Intel to exclude previous OSes to Win 10.  If that is the case, then there is surely some dodgy dealings going on.  The point was/is that Microsoft is claiming security concerns with pre-10 OSes [such as Win 7] running on Skylake processors [other new hardware], and therefore would be disabled.  The truth is, there need not be any security risks/concerns with Win 7 or 8.1.  It is just another of MS' tactics to corral everyone into its walled garden.

As for companies releasing Win 7 - 8.1 drivers, I hope you're right.  However, I have seen companies like Creative discontinue support for some hardware on some OSes.... and after all, MS does want Win 10 running on as many PCs as it can... if not all.   Like I said, I hope you're right, because people should have the choice/right to run Win 7 if they want.

MS is saying they wont support Windows 7, not that it wont run.  They can claim that it wont run, but they really have nothing to do with what hardware Windows 7 does or doesn't run on.  Their current prevarications on what they'll support or wont support are irrelevant if Intel still puts out compatible firmware and drivers for a new chipset.  Intel will continue to do so until there is not enough demand to make it worthwhile and they don't have to worry about not selling chipsets because some old fart still has 7.

As far as I know, XP hasn't been supported by Intel since 2011, and Vista is already by the wayside as well, but these are Intel's decisions, not Microsoft's.  It's simply not their call to make.

Extended support is down to security fixes, they weren't going to be troubleshooting someone's driver issues to begin with.  If they actually do end up getting caught making deals with companies to obsolete peoples software, they'll both hang themselves legally for defrauding purchasers with forced upgrades.  It would be very messy for Microsoft, that's the kind of shit that ends companies.

What bothers me is that MS makes semi-true/semi-false statements, engages in 'accidental downloads', the current GWX panel deception, and updates without description or misleading descriptions.

Worse? There's nothing wrong with W7 anymore than with XP. They all could have evolved in orderly steps from less to more sophisticated...and it all could have been done the same way as now, via Windows Update...although imperfect. At least W10 is making that part easy.

The lie that W10 is more secure than W7...bothers me as well. There are so many insecure machines/the net...and even security software itself which make machines less secure via the software update mechanisms and 'elevation of privileges', and the "tools" they produce (as well as browser extensions) [here] that I ask how in hell can anyone claim this OS is more secure than that?

I don't believe that to be true. While it may not be exerting pressure, such as was exerted on PC manufacturers when 8 came out not to offer 7, or else. There has to be communication between the various vendors to ensure that the end product performs as expected. Intel primarily provides chips for new PC/laptops/mobile applications. Why devote production lines to make a chip for an older model not used by their clients? So, MS decisions about what they offer has impacted vendors up and down the line, including Intel. Cause and effect.

^^^  What Doc said.

Quoting Daiwa: Until I can't.

If that's the case the fact that I'm already running W10 would seem to be irrelevant. Then there's the roll back option. I can go back to 8.1 and that makes MS's efforts futile at best IMO. 

This may be OT: Ran across this article on ZDNet.

http://www.zdnet.com/article/windows-10-subscriptions-arent-happening-heres-why/

If it is...apologies.

Uvah...not to worry. OT is the rule on my posts.

That's not what I remember reading.  What I read [I believe from a link at majorgeeks] suggested that Skylake processors and motherboards would not support Win 7 due to security concerns.... not that I give a toss anyhow.  It's not likely I'll be getting a Skylake CPU anytime soon, and I no longer have a copy of Win 7 to put on a PC of any kind.

No, MS just crippled a portion of the support lifespan of Win7 on Skylake beginning some time in 2017, after which only 'really' important security updates (in the sole discretion of MS) will be offered for Win7 on those Skylake rigs, up through the scheduled end-of-life-cycle in 2020.  So, Win7 will 'run' on a Skylake rig until 2020 if you want it to, just might be dodgy from a security or driver standpoint, whatever that may mean.  Going forward, they're not going to let OEM's put Win7 on Sklyake or newer chips (except for the specific MFR's they've 'whitelisted' for the crippled support after 2017) most likely with the consent & collusion of the MFR's, IMO - mutual self-interests are being served.

Windows 7 is in extended support, so it's already down to security updates only.  It sounds more like they're talking about some people getting more than just security updates, not that they're trying to shaft users beyond what they pledged in terms of the support schedule.

I still seem to get a fair number of non-security updates offered up.  But as a practical matter, the security updates are the only ones of importance.  I saw something about MS stopping generic peripheral driver updates at some point for Win7 on newer hardware, which may be the extent of 'crippling' support.  With the hardware rapidly outrunning Win7, it may just be a matter of 'unanticipated asynchrony'.

I looked for the article I read regarding this but can't find it again; however, it did suggest that Win 7 would not run on Skylake and later tech after 2017.  The article said that important drivers and software would no longer be issued by MS or its partners, thus causing Win 7 to malfunction and needing to shut down.... which I imagine is getting BSODs all the time.  That, I also imagine, would make the OS inoperable/unuseable.

Anyway, that's what I remember!  Whether it is correct or not, I don't know, but the article was supposedly quoting sources at Microsoft.  In any event, it doesn't affect me, though I do feel for those Win 7 users who don't want to 'downgrade' to Win 10.

I would think that the OS would continue to run fine and continue to work with existing (working) peripherals, it just might not be able to run some new peripherals or video cards, etc., for lack of drivers, things like that.  I doubt you'll simply fire it up one day and find MS has actively sabotaged your rig to a BSOD.  MS may be dumb in many ways, but not in that way (I hope).