Ramblings of an old Doc

 

Interesting…first, what does Brave browser do?

“The browser's revenue model, Eich explained nearly three months ago, was based on ad blocking. Brave will scrub websites of most of their ads and all tracking, then replace those now-empty slots with ads it sells. Seventy percent of the revenue from Brave's ad sales would be shared with publishers (55%) and users (15%). The latter will be able to turn that money -- in Bitcoin form -- over to their favorite sites or keep it. Brave will retain 15%, with the remaining 15% going to advertising partners.” – Computerworld

The publishers…representing more than 1,700 newspapers here in the USA say that is indistinguishable from theft, and in the cease-and-desist letter, promised to take legal action if Brave persisted:

"Your plan to use our content to sell your advertising is indistinguishable from a plan to steal our content to publish on your own website [emphasis in original]," lawyers for 17 publishers wrote in a letter to Brave Software's founder and CEO, Brendan Eich. – ibid

Eich also stated that browsers do not republish anything…and that’s true.

"If it were the case that Brave's browsers perform 'republication,' then so too does Safari's Reader mode, and the same goes for any ad-blocker-equipped browser, or the Links text-only browser, or screen readers for the visually impaired," the company said. "We sympathize with publishers concerned about the damage that pure ad blockers do to their ability to pay their bills via advertising revenue. However, this problem long pre-dates Brave." – Eich

The problem centers around revenue, advertising revenue and ad blocking. Many sites refuse you access if you’re using ad blockers. Eich’s browser may well find itself blocked as well. He states his browser will save the web…for a fee. He says you’ll get a cut. But you’ll pay more for goods and services, because of it and because he’ll tell the advertisers that he’s making sure their ads remain malware free. That’s exactly what any corporation with stockholders does, namely providing goods/services for a fee and calls it “dividends”. Stockholders get the dividends but pay more for the goods/services as a result.

Anyway, I think it’s an interesting issue.

Your thoughts?

Source:

http://www.computerworld.com/article/3054032/web-browsers/us-newspapers-threaten-to-sue-brave-browser-maker-over-ad-blocking-scheme.html


Comments (Page 1)
2 Pages1 2 
on Apr 09, 2016

The problem is that many people think they they have the right to display whatever adds they want. I would argue that they shouldn't. However, the internet isn't free and ads have filled that financial void. No free lunch and all. It is far from the ideal model for the internet, so I'm interested in seeing different models.

Wikipedia gets all its funding through donations, so they don't need ads. It also means that they can be independent because ad providers can't suddenly threaten remove their ads and funding because they disprove of an article that Wikipedia is hosting. I know that many TV shows avoid risky topics because they can't afford to live without ad revenue, and some have crossed that line and have been cancelled.

on Apr 09, 2016

I like the browser. That said, I don't claim to know anything about coding and everything else it takes to make a browser, but I was curious from the start how they were managing to block ads and still make money. Question answered.

I hope it works out in their favor or they can come to some kind of agreement without having to change anything because I like it as it is, which is clean, simple, and fast. I like it for a good secondary browser.

Also, still really digging the Vivaldi browser. I'm waiting to see how it goes. Firefox and Chrome are so big right now, I don't see people leaving either in droves anymore than they left Facebook for Google+, but I would love to see Vivaldi succeed and gain a foothold in the top five, if not top three browsers. I could easily dump Chrome for Vivaldi as it is now.

on Apr 09, 2016


"Your plan to use our content to sell your advertising is indistinguishable from a plan to steal our content to publish on your own website

I'm inclined to agree with that.  Replacing the ads is an extra step from blocking the ads and would seem to me to be crossing a line.  They're essentially hi-jacking the traffic.

on Apr 09, 2016

a bit below the belt if it displays ad in the same place where the original ads are.

now, if it were to have the top edge of the browser (or some other edge) as some sort of permanent ad space where the ad doesn't have anything to do with any site visited that's different. (not in legal terms.. no clue about those. but conceptionally a bit more acceptable)

blocking ad is good. this ain't blocking ads.

on Apr 09, 2016

Well, the ads aren't screened for malware...so on one hand Brave is doing a good thing...but this smacks a bit too much like a protection racket to me...

But the arguments pro and con are interesting.

on Apr 09, 2016

Browser hijacking....

A phrase people have despised since browsers were invented.

Thinking you are going somewhere to see something....only to end up seeing something else.

 

It's Browser hijacking.

 

It will be dead in the water just as soon as the Lawyers articulate correctly.

on Apr 09, 2016

Just how is it browser hijacking?

It doesn't take you to any other site than the one you type in. The ads on that site will be either allowed or not allowed and supplanted with screened, paid advertising, which won't have malware...and you get a percentage of the profits (albeit tiny).

Browser hijacking according to Bleepingcomputer:

Browser Hijacking refers to a piece of software that is installed on your computer and that overrides the default functionality of your web browser. It does this without your permission and tends to be very difficult to remove. 
Some of the ways that these software hijack your computer is as follows:

  • You go to www.google.com and search for a keyword.  Instead of getting the results from Google, you will instead be taken to the hijackers search engine where they make money from their advertises.
  • Your browsers home page is overriden, and you are brought automatically to the hijackers website.
  • You click to go to a online shopping site for printer ink cartridges, and instead of going to the site you wanted to, you are instead brought to an advertises of the hijackers site. 

Popular tools that can remove these types of programs are SpyBot, Hijack This, and Cool Web Shredder. Links to these tools can be found in the Resources section of this site.

on Apr 10, 2016

You aren't going to the site you intend to...you go to an altered site that displays unsolicited advertising that even the site itself did not sanction.

The ads are definitely hijacked content.

It will eventually be deemed illegal.

Removing ads is not entirely legitimate in all countries either.

EG...PVRs that can eliminated the ads from being recorded are not legal everywhere.

on Apr 10, 2016

on the bright side, removing ads (from webpage) is legit in germany (courts ruled so.. multiple times)

http://arstechnica.co.uk/business/2016/03/adblocking-and-whitelists-legal-rules-german-court/

 

so i guess if they move hq to there they'll be safe with the blocking part though probably not the hijacking.

on Apr 10, 2016


You aren't going to the site you intend to...you go to an altered site that displays unsolicited advertising that even the site itself did not sanction.

That is incorrect. You are brought to the exact url of the site, and nowhere else. Therefore it is not hijacking. 

As for eventual legal outcomes, that may or may not come true. As I said, it's an interesting dilemma, and I do not side with Eich.

However, it is not browser hijacking. 

on Apr 10, 2016

It's shrewd marketing strategy. I do not think people would care more this browser anyway.  

on Apr 10, 2016

OK...have it your way.

Call it site hijacking then.

The site you are supposed to see is not the one you end up seeing .

Advertising content is altered.

The site doesn't sanction the advertising 'inserted'....and YOU don't actually want it either.

Ergo no-one wins.

Oh, wait....the makers of "Brave Browser" win.

As long as it profits them at others' expense....sounds like the lawyers will be the eventual winners...

on Apr 10, 2016

The site is the site is the site. It is determined by the url.

You don't know what advertising is there before navigating there anymore than you know which tree will fall down tomorrow. 

You're also safer, because the wonderful advertising you do see is malware free...so, no "drive bys", etc. If the ad services did their due diligence, there would be no Brave browser.

Not just they win and you win (malware free), there's a very small amount paid to you every month or every few months.

And do the makers win? Sure they do...do the makers of Chrome, Edge, IE, Ff, Pale Moon, Vivaldi win? Sure they do. So why is your eye narrowed with respect to Brave? At least THEY pay YOU something and you stay malware free...as if you care which ads you see.

on Apr 10, 2016


The site doesn't sanction the advertising 'inserted'....and YOU don't actually want it either.

Yeah, you do, because you chose to use a browser that does that specifically as a feature.

If you don't want ads at all, you'd just use any other browser with a blocker.

on Apr 10, 2016

OK...let's put it simply.

Stardock's sites have advertising.  It helps [a little] with the cost of actually having a site.

That being the case, BOTH the Advertisers AND Stardock hope the site visitors will show interest in the Advertising...and benefit the Advertisers AND therefore the site.

How the fuck does some Pirating inserter of site advertising content benefit the site?  [See? I said 'pirating' not 'hijacking' just to appease the pedantic].

The Browser user gets paid?  Whoopee-do.

It's virus-free?  Wow.  But how does a site VET the content being [oh god I almost said 'hijacked'] inserted without consent 'onto' the site - whether virus free or not?

 

A User of 'Brave' sees the site [yes, I'm not an idiot...it's the same url] but not with advertising content contracted BY the site but with 'something else' contracted by Brave.

People who use ad-blockers aren't exactly playing fair either, not when the INTENDED process to actually remove advertising being seen is via paying a subscription to the site....which, wait for it...also benefits the site even MORE.

 

If people get their way I'd anticipate the Browser itself ending up being blocked from some urls instead...

2 Pages1 2